Doctors won't operate on 8-year-old girl because her Medicaid doesn't pay enough.

[NightMist]

Originally Posted by silverseeds

rant away....

but it is a dead end. it cannot stand, imo. we have more and more expensive procedures all the time. where do we draw the line? Many procedures even good insurance will not pay for.

where will the money come from? Out voting people to take MORE of their cash when so many live pay check to paycheck NOW???? and calling it fair?

Will you deny that will lead to calls to publically control how people feed themselves? or what activities they embark on?

but really this is all moot. we do not have even remotely close to enough money to pay for our debts now. Our debts grows by the year. we cant even remotely close pay for medicaid and medicare that we are all ready on the hook for.

whether or not the left or right wants to admit it, our lives are in for a MAJOR change soon. Our dollar is being killed. Our debts well past the manageable levels......

Heres a solution that is actually workable in the real world. bypass insurance companies all together..... Cut out the middle men. form a collective that doesnt need the bulk of what the insurance company is. you can pay into it the level of benefits you like. presumably it could be much cheaper then insurance even including the fact insurance denies many claims.

But forcing a dieing economy to over extend itself further, will not last long. If you cant see that, we will have to agree to disagree on that point. I know our eonomic issues are being downplayed on the propaganda boxes, but we arent in good shape. We have spent our children into debt slavery. We have ensured our dollar will drop greatly in value over time. we have ensured global anger at our actions, do to our dollar being the current global reserve currency. The whole world knows its going to hurt to replace the dollar in that role, yet the moves are being made anyway. People not being able to afford medical care is the least of our issues, and the myth that we have the money to even remotely try to address it, will be dead soon.

Fair?

Fair is for children and idealists.
There is nothing fair in this world.

You are bang on right about the insurance companies.
We are in total agreement there.

The job of insurance companies is to make money.
They are a betting parlor and they do whatever they can to fix the odds and rig the games.

So far as taxes, if everybody paid what they ought it would be a bit less scary eh?

Looking at other countries with things like a national health service, every time there is a rise in taxes somebody starts screaming about how they ought to make people do this, that or the other thing, to lower health costs and save money on the program. It never happens.
Of course Americans are just crazy enough, and eager enough to believe the bull pucky propagandists spew, to vote some nutball thing in. So maybe insurance reform is the way to go in this country.

So far as the economy, we are where the pure capitalism idealists have brought us. The argument made sense, a lot of sense. However it did not account for the fact that most of the people running the businesses that benefited from those policies were in it just for the money and could care less about the impact on the economy, or anything else, that their decisions had. Thus tax breaks and other incentives only made them wealthier and did not create jobs.

Where I live most of the big businesses are gone, with a little help from the state and locals we have some small businesses up and coming. Best thing is unemployment is down to 9%, the lowest it has been since before the Regan administration.

[DesiG]

I think part of our out of control health care costs is because the majority of Americans just don't take care of themselves. They smoke, they don't exercise, they eat **** food and they are horribly overweight.
The step mom of an ex boyfriend weighed about 300 lbs. She has really bad knee problems. Her Dr told her, just lose weight and your knee problems will go away. Did she? **** no, it was too much of an effort for her to curtail her food intake and no way was she going to exercise, that was too much work. So, she shopped around and finally found a Dr that would do the knee replacement. And guess what? The insurance company paid for this. What a bunch of ****. i would have told her to lose the weight because we would NOT pay for unneeded surgery.

[Alabamy]

We need cities that are more walkable. The way things are laid out in this country promotes a lifestyle without exercise. How many Americans are willing to walk 1 mile to go out to dinner?

[fruits&nuts]

Originally Posted by DesiG

I think part of our out of control health care costs is because the majority of Americans just don't take care of themselves. They smoke, they don't exercise, they eat **** food and they are horribly overweight.
The step mom of an ex boyfriend weighed about 300 lbs. She has really bad knee problems. Her Dr told her, just lose weight and your knee problems will go away. Did she? **** no, it was too much of an effort for her to curtail her food intake and no way was she going to exercise, that was too much work. So, she shopped around and finally found a Dr that would do the knee replacement. And guess what? The insurance company paid for this. What a bunch of ****. i would have told her to lose the weight because we would NOT pay for unneeded surgery.

That is so true. People eat junk, then wonder why their bodies don't work right. The average MD knows less about nutrition than the average bartender.

[DesiG]

Originally Posted by Alabamy

We need cities that are more walkable. The way things are laid out in this country promotes a lifestyle without exercise. How many Americans are willing to walk 1 mile to go out to dinner?

Are you kidding me? Most of them circle the parking lot looking for a parking spot 18 ft closer to the front door than the one they just passed up.

[darwinslair]

Originally Posted by Alabamy

We need cities that are more walkable. The way things are laid out in this country promotes a lifestyle without exercise. How many Americans are willing to walk 1 mile to go out to dinner?

<laughing> i walked more than a mile today looking for a dinner to shoot.

Tom

[spud]

I've been a nurse for 17 yrs and I could tell you stories that would make your head spin. We live in a very selfish society were everybody wants everything thing and nobody cares were the money comes from. From the 92 yr old admitted to icu for pneumonia with heart problems to leukemic pt with only 6 to 9 months to live that wants everything done and doesn't care that those 6 to 9 months cost a half a mil. Or how about to 30 something that get a lung transplant cause he smoked too much and is now on disabilty(on our dime) but is well enough to play on a golf league. Or how about the family that brings their family member from a foreign country that can't get the advanced health care that we provide. Gees, all they want is their family member to get his much needed heart bypass surgery, opps, except he has never payed a dime into the system.

We are being played like a bunch of suckers and there is plenty of blame to go around. From the lawyers to insurance companies and the huge bureaucracies that hospitals create. How about politicians that would pass legislation that would limit the above abuses.

Whether we like it or not, we need rationed care cause we cannot afford all the high tech care offered. Alot of the high tech care goes to extending life only a short period of time at tremendous cost.

We use so much health(sickness) care in this country, that we have to import nurses from other countries.

If you think things are bad now, just wait in ten years. Chornic diseases like diabeties and obesity numbers will be through the roof, putting costs even greater than they are now.

[Cliff Timmons]

Originally Posted by reavilh

Wonder if this is the same argument used by the Rich Man when God asked him about Lazarus?

Are we talking about religion or politics?
Do we want to blend the two?

[Cliff Timmons]

Originally Posted by Alabamy

Cliff there is a free rider problem inherent in that sort of system. Some might choose not to pay for public schools but they would still benefit from having an educated population.

So since the government is smarter than the people and know what's best for them, they should take the money from them?
Perhaps the government knows better than us about seeds and since Monsanto is in the government's ear, only those seeds should be legal?
After all, the government knows best.

[Cliff Timmons]

Originally Posted by Alabamy

We need cities that are more walkable. The way things are laid out in this country promotes a lifestyle without exercise. How many Americans are willing to walk 1 mile to go out to dinner?

Let's make it a law!
We know what's best for them!